andyom
Voting Comrade
Posts: 2
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Post by andyom on Nov 6, 2005 18:02:55 GMT
What are your feelings about the rioting in the Parisian suburbs? What are the necessary steps needed to be taken to reach some kind of sustainable resolution?
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Ketoprofen
Defence Forces
Ketoprofen - The Proletariat Coalition
Posts: 1,883
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Post by Ketoprofen on Nov 6, 2005 20:07:26 GMT
The ousting of Sarkozy from the Cabinet, mass-governmental resignation, dissolution of the Assembly and the holding of general elections, in my opinion.
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Post by D.S. of Soviet Sexy Girls on Nov 6, 2005 20:54:19 GMT
LOL. What you've suggested Ket, other from being a little too extremist and unrealistic, won't change anything, apart maybe the point on Sarkozy.
Necessary steps ? First of all, re-install order by all means necessary. These people (most young one) that are burning everything are hurting their own neighborhood, hurting workers that have asked nothing and saw their cars or work tools vanishing in ashes... The violence is going too far, maybe it is some kind of retaliation against Police's skids, and a way to pass all the anger they may have, but it's totally pointless and hurts them more than anything. Nothing can be done if violences continue.
Once the order is re-installed, serious measures should be taken to help these people to a larger extend then what has been done yet. Betterment of infrastructures in the Cités, social programs to help them finding decent jobs and maybe a nation-wide action to fight discrimination, that is a major source of anger for them...
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Post by Star City on Nov 6, 2005 21:16:01 GMT
The violence is going too far, maybe it is some kind of retaliation against Police's skids, and a way to pass all the anger they may have, but it's totally pointless and hurts them more than anything. No-one was paying attention to them, now they are.
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Post by D.S. of Soviet Sexy Girls on Nov 6, 2005 22:16:42 GMT
Sure. But does it worth it to do it that way ?
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Post by Novhomoj on Nov 6, 2005 23:13:29 GMT
More often than not, yes. I hope they make it.
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Post by Star City on Nov 6, 2005 23:40:20 GMT
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Post by Star City on Nov 7, 2005 18:43:51 GMT
I was unfortunately exposed to mainstream media today. Lots of people who don't know what they're talking about explaining that because France does not promote multiculturalism (like Blair's beautiful Britain) it was breeding hate-filled cesspools of Islamic fundamentalism. Like I said, people who know fuck-all.
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Grothistan
Military Diplomat
Prime Minister of the Equilism Commonwealth
Posts: 66
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Post by Grothistan on Nov 7, 2005 19:57:41 GMT
I don't believe these riots were a matter of choice from the rioters side. It is an unavoidable effect of a society that marginalises such a large group, keeps it in poverty, and has a political climate dominated by hate and mistrust to the aforementioned group (muslims). The sad deaths of the two young immigrants was merely a catalysator.
The only sensible way of stopping it is to try and reach a compromise with the rioters. Show them that you are willing to work with them. Contrary to common belief, people who riot aren't mad animals. After this is done, introduce severe social reforms to help the people living in these areas.
Another approach could be to try and mobilize the rioters against the state, and introduce an anti-capitalist stance to their ranks, and let the socialist youth movements join in and help. However, at this time, the state is still too strong for me to believe that it'll work out in the long running. After a few weeks of the riot spreading, they'll send in the army, and the state will call it a succes of democracy.
Regardless, I hope that these riots will have an overall positive effect. Maybe it'll help people realize the gross unequality and descrimination in western europe.
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Post by Dobbyniania on Nov 7, 2005 20:45:38 GMT
I agree with groth on this one, the state is too stable to right now for any government toppling to occur. Negotiations and much needed reforms should be initiated immediately. Moreover the interior minister should resign within the week and new elections should be called for the national assembly.
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Post by D.S. of Soviet Sexy Girls on Nov 7, 2005 20:59:48 GMT
I don't see why new elections should be called for ? Even if the Assembly that got elected is a conservative one, it should go to the end of its term, that is democracy, not changing the whole Assembly each time a part of the population riots, especially when that part is rather small.
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Post by Dobbyniania on Nov 7, 2005 21:48:22 GMT
LOL and slipping little pieces of paper in a box is? Look seb, majoritarianism is not the be all to end all of democratic policy. Majoritarian rule only subsists when the polity unanimously supports the government in principle. Here a large portion of the polity does not support the government in principle and they must eventually agree with said government or the government will not function.
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Post by D.S. of Soviet Sexy Girls on Nov 7, 2005 22:29:54 GMT
What do you call the polity ? I'm unfamilliar with that word, and the best translation I can find is régime.
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Post by Dobbyniania on Nov 7, 2005 23:17:23 GMT
polity= the people of the state. it can also mean regime.
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Ketoprofen
Defence Forces
Ketoprofen - The Proletariat Coalition
Posts: 1,883
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Post by Ketoprofen on Nov 8, 2005 7:23:27 GMT
I don't see why new elections should be called for ? Even if the Assembly that got elected is a conservative one, it should go to the end of its term, that is democracy, not changing the whole Assembly each time a part of the population riots, especially when that part is rather small. These are the most violent riots in France since May 68. Something is wrong. Oust Sarkozy, hold general elections and if necessary, use force to make your voice heard.
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